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Author Topic: Problems with GarbageCollect?  (Read 11153 times)

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Offline thepenguin77

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2012, 08:20:42 pm »
Disable zStart and try doing stuff. I know sometimes when I reinstall it (from computer) the calculator will sometimes crash.

If this fixes it, I believe there are two problems:
1. TI doesn't update the hook pointers perfectly (I think this is an issue already, but I've never looked into it)
2. You have a garbage app somewhere, check Calcsys for a gap in the app numbers.
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Offline DrDnar

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2012, 11:48:58 pm »
Quote from: Darl181 on January 09, 2012, 09:14:54 pm
Ok I feel smart right now...I put in another set of batteries and the issues disappeared.
Does TIOS have problems detecting the battery level of NiMH's, by any chance?
Yes and no. The OS tends to complain about low batteries before the NiMH batteries are actually nearing depletion because NiMH batteries operate at a lower voltage, nominally 1.2 V, which means four of them give a nominal 4.8 V. This is a problem because the original TI-83+ was designed to run on 5.0 V and that's what the OS checks for. However, the TI-84+ family is designed around 3.3 V logic, so the actual hardware will run just fine on 4.8 V; the OS just doesn't know this. In fact, if you write your own operating system or patch the OS, you can see that the calculator will indeed run just fine on less than four volts, including archiving and unarchiving &c. The only thing that won't work is the USB driver, because part of the USB spec requires a 5.0 V bus. Unfortunately, random parts of the OS code check the current voltage and may silently abort if the voltage is low, so you can still get strange behavior.

tl;dr: NiMH batteries supply a lower voltage than what the OS expects. The hardware itself works fine on that voltage, but the OS doesn't know that, so it tends to give up (and fail silently) when it shouldn't.

Also, if you want, thepenguin77 or I could throw together a program that does a true full memory clear (except for the boot code, of course).
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Offline Darl181

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2012, 11:50:37 pm »
Hm, so maybe during a GarbageCollect it 'silently fails' to write something and doesn't notify?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 03:11:18 pm by Darl181 »
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Offline DrDnar

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #18 on: January 11, 2012, 12:02:00 am »
No, thepenguin's archive cleaner would fix that. Though it might be worth it to check for a garbage app.

Also, the full memory clear I suggested above can be done using the boot code self-test: remove a battery, hold MODE, replace the battery, and turn the calculator on.
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Offline Darl181

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #19 on: January 11, 2012, 12:28:59 am »
So, this mode+batt self-test is different from the mode, alpha+s self-test?
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Offline DrDnar

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #20 on: January 11, 2012, 01:18:35 am »
Quote from: Darl181 on January 11, 2012, 12:28:59 am
So, this mode+batt self-test is different from the mode, alpha+s self-test?
Extremely. The normal self-test won't erase your operating system, for example. The only function of the boot's self-test is to ensure the flash chip is functional. It does not, however, test the certificate or boot code for integrity.

By the way, the boot-code self-test loops forever. Also, after performing it and reinstalling your OS, you'll appear to have an extra 64 K of archive space because there is no swap sector. Do 2nd+Mem>Reset>All Memory before loading any apps or programs or else the next the garbage collect will fail.
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Offline Darl181

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #21 on: January 13, 2012, 02:34:50 pm »
I haven't tried the full-erase yet, but I just got the problem again and this time looked at it more closely.
 - The problem is always the same: the OS can't seem to change the contrast
 - When turning on the calc, the LCD is at minimum contrast.  zStart app reports that it's set to something like 63.
 - Trying to turn up contrast prints a junk token where the number normally appears (0D ) and achieves nothing.
 - Trying to run the contrast down seems to cut almost all power to the LCD, maybe minimum contrast?  It looks like it's printing something here as well.
 - Asm programs can change the contrast successfully, such as an axe program containing Shade()
 - When the contrast is turned down/off, and fixed by an asm program, the junk token changes.
 - While clearing RAM, the contrast is set properly.  It doesn't fix the glitch tho.  However once the calc is turned off this is apparently lost, and on the next startup it's low again.
 - The On+Del trick sets the contrast right, albeit clearing ram.  Haven't tried OS self-test.
 - At times, it seems to be fixed, when turning the calc on/off works properly.  However, installing, or maybe just running, an app (maybe any app?) tends to break it again.
 - I looked at calcsys for a bit, the App vat seems to have the numbers going in sequential order, starting with Axe on page 62 and ending with Calcsys on page 69.

Edit: after uninstalling zStart and clearing ram, it's back to normal.  When I re-install zStart the glitch returns.
Maybe I ought to re-send that one app, see if it works?

Edit2: unchecked everything and installed, and it' working properly.  Now to find the culprit setting..
Post-edit: It doesn't seem to be any setting..installing any part of it seems to cause problems.  Even running the app seems to cause the err...
What's weird is that it only started doing this recently, after something, maybe or maybe not garbageCollect, messed up multiple times.

Edit3: zStart 1.3.005 btw
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 06:16:23 pm by Darl181 »
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Offline ztrumpet

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #22 on: January 13, 2012, 03:02:57 pm »
That's funny, Darl; I have a similar glitch with zStart messing with the contrast in a method similar to how you mention it, only less seriously.  For me, here is what's still true:  (bolded words changed from the original)
Quote from: Darl181 on January 13, 2012, 02:34:50 pm
- When turning on the calc, the LCD is infrequently at minimum contrast.  zStart app reports that it's set to something like 48.
 - Trying to run the contrast down seems to cut almost all power to the LCD, maybe minimum contrast?
 - While clearing RAM, the contrast is set properly.  It doesn't fix the glitch tho.  However once the calc is turned off this is apparently lost, and on the startup it's infrequently low again.
Edit: after uninstalling zStart and clearing ram, it's back to normal.  When I re-install zStart the glitch returns.
Maybe I ought to re-send that one app, see if it works?

Edit2: unchecked everything and installed, and it appears to work properly for a while and then resorts back to its old habits.
It's something zStart related.
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Offline Darl181

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2012, 06:18:25 pm »
In the meantime, I've been able to "fix" the problem by having an axe program run on startup, the source of which is just Shade(48) ;D
(just need to not turn it down accidentally :P)

Edit.  Uninstalled everything in zStart, uninstalled zStart itself, deleted the appvar, cleared ram and reinstalled stuff.  It's been working properly for ~20 minutes now :D
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 07:34:31 pm by Darl181 »
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Offline TIfanx1999

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2012, 11:31:41 pm »
This is really strange. It must be some bug running around that has gone unnoticed or has been introduced recently. There must be something in Zstart that is triggering the contrast to be set to minimum on certain conditions, or perhaps a setting isn't being changed back properly upon exiting. Very strange though...
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Offline Darl181

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2012, 01:08:12 am »
Evidently the problem was something weird with the appvar mentioned two posts above, the calc's been behaving for the entire day.
:D
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Offline TIfanx1999

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Re: Problems with GarbageCollect?
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2012, 01:13:15 am »
Oh, still really strange. I'm glad to hear that your calc. appears to be behaving normally now though. :)
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