Author Topic: KnightOS  (Read 205506 times)

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Offline Munchor

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #420 on: November 12, 2010, 07:44:26 pm »
Since you're coding in Asm( it's probable that it is short and fast.

So, I'm mainly waiting for programming capabilities and would like to help making a Python-like programming language for basic code (equivalent to Hex code, but in Python).

Another thing I'm really expecting are the new graphing capabilities and math included functions.

I don't think these two last are very hard to do, so you should mainly work on them.

A program to hold 'cheats' for tests like Noteflio but better included would be also tremendously important, since I am pretending on using KnightOS in all classes and tests.

Grayscale and contrast is also interesting, but not AS interesting as the ones above this.

So, I hope for the final release, even, unfortunately, secretly knowing that 2011 will be the year.

Good Luck and Keep on Working

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #421 on: November 12, 2010, 11:06:55 pm »
would the contrast be thread-specific?
No.

ScoutDavid, I'd love to see something python-esque on KOS!  Also, the graphing and math capabilities will be glorious.  There is also a notepad program, which I am considering allowing PrettyPrint on.

Offline DJ Omnimaga

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #422 on: November 13, 2010, 02:12:42 am »
No, of course you will be able to change the contrast :P I just don't want to make the kernel handle it.
Oh ok phew. IMHO it would be weird if you couldn't even change the contrast in KOS. Some calcs have contrast level 1-2 as default settings, like my TI-86.

Offline Eeems

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #423 on: November 13, 2010, 03:26:43 am »
I was kinda thinking it would be nice to include it in the kernel, they are pretty small routines after all.
/e

Offline matthias1992

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #424 on: November 13, 2010, 07:42:17 am »
Well I wonder how much it really matters in terms of speed wether or not something is included in the kernel. Actually to be honest I never comprehended what a kernel is except that it is the lowest, core, system. I mean the word 'kernel' does not really make you suspect anything whereas BIOS (Basic Input Output Service) is pretty obvious...

Anyway, great progress! I am looking forward to paly around with it a little albeit I may not understand half of what you are doing :P
ooh well, I am pretty sure you'll outrun TIos with ease haha...:)
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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #425 on: November 13, 2010, 08:43:22 am »
I was kinda thinking it would be nice to include it in the kernel, they are pretty small routines after all.
I may eventually change my mind.  But all it does is pull from memory, increment/decrement it, and set the contrast to it.

Offline Michael_Lee

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #426 on: November 13, 2010, 10:08:34 am »
Hi - I'm pretty certain that some of these questions have been answered before, but I'd still like ask them all - just in case I misread or missed something.

0] Developers version by 2011 - what can be done with it?  What can't be done?

1] Is there any way to alternate between running KnightOS and TIOS?  I know that you can't double boot, but will there be some kind of feature that allows me to start a conversion between them?  Could I plug in a mini USB containing both OSes and run a sort of app to load which one I want?  Or do I have to use the computer and a connecting program to switch?  In essence, will there be any way at all to convert between KnightOS and TIOS without a computer?  If so, will it be quick/easy?

2] What kind of math features will be added?  I'm fairly certain that at one point, you said it would have all of the math functions, and more, of the TIOS.  Will this have symbolic manipulation (where '(X+3)(X+4)' displays 'X2+7X+12')?

3] How compatible will KnightOS be with Basic games, hybrid Basic games, normal assembly games, Axe assembly games, MirageOS/DoorsCS/Ion/etc. games, apps?  I think you said that Basic games would have to be ported, but how about a computer converter that transforms Basic games into KnightOS games?  And in converse, something that transforms KnightOS games to TIOS assembly/Basic?

4] Will trees be possible?  I don't know what they are, but apparently they're cool, so it'd be interesting to be able to muck around with them.

5] Will the font be the same, or will you switch it?

6] The programming language: will it be similar to Basic, or will it be a varient of C, or will it resemble another programming language?

7] Will graphing be faster?  Will it allow 3d?  Possibly 4d?

8] How safe will the built-in programming language be?  Will it be more like Basic or more like Axe?  Or will it try to compromise and try to have the best of both (safety of Basic, speed of Axe)?

9] How large will I be able to compute numbers?  Like TIOS, do I have to switch to scientific notation after a while (1.337 * 10^13), or will that output 13370000000000?

A] Will KnightOS come with support for programming 3d graphics?

B] Could I use my calc as a USB device?  Could I attach it to the computer, transfer, say, a Powerpoint document, take it to school, then run it directly from the calc?  Could I transfer something on the size of Word documents?  Could I secretly have a web browser tucked away somewhere in my calc?

C] How easy will it be to transfer files to and from KnightOS to the computer?  Could I just hook the calculator up and treat it like any other USB device, or will I have to use a special program?

D] Will KnightOS have usb support built in?  What about support for that little circly thing that I can play music out of?  

E] Could I play music with KnightOS?  How good will it be?  If I have music running on one program, could I switch over to another program and play, say, Tetris while listening to the original running in the background?

F] How compatible will this be with the lab instruments you can hook up to the z80 calculators?  For that matter, how compatible will this be with other calculators running TIOS?  Could I transfer data/games between the two?
« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 04:49:06 pm by Michael_Lee »
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Offline Munchor

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #427 on: November 13, 2010, 10:19:01 am »
Spoiler For Spoiler:
Hi - I'm pretty certain that some of these questions have been answered before, but I'd still like ask them all - just in case I misread or missed something.

0] Developers version by 2011 - what can I do with it?  What can't I do?

1] Is there any way to alternate between running KnightOS and TIOS?  I know that you can't double boot, but will there be some kind of feature that allows me to start a conversion between them?  Could I plug in a mini USB containing both OSes and run a sort of app to load which one I want?  Or do I have to use the computer and a connecting program to switch?

2] What kind of math features will be added?  I'm fairly certain that at one point, you said it would have all of the math functions, and more, of the TIOS.  Will this have symbolic manipulation (where '(X+3)(X+4)' displays 'X2+7X+12')?

3] How compatible will KnightOS be with Basic games, hybrid Basic games, normal assembly games, Axe assembly games, MirageOS/DoorsCS/Ion/etc. games, apps?  I think you said that Basic games would have to be ported, but how about a computer converter that transforms Basic games into KnightOS games?  And in converse, something that transforms KnightOS games to TIOS assembly/Basic?

4] Will trees be possible?  I don't know what they are, but apparently they're cool, so it'd be interesting to be able to muck around with them.

5] Will the font be the same, or will you switch it?

6] The programming language: will it be similar to Basic, or will it be a varient of C, or will it resemble another programming language?

7] Will graphing be faster?  Will it allow 3d?  Possibly 4d?

8] How safe will the built-in programming language be?  Will it be more like Basic or more like Axe?  Or will it try to compromise and try to have the best of both (safety of Basic, speed of Axe)?

9] How large will I be able to compute numbers?  Like TIOS, do I have to switch to scientific notation after a while (1.337 * 10^13), or will that output 13370000000000?

A] Will KnightOS come with support for programming 3d graphics?

B] Could I use my calc as a USB device?  Could I attach it to the computer, transfer, say, a Powerpoint document, take it to school, then run it directly from the calc?  Could I transfer something on the size of Word documents?  Could I secretly have a web browser tucked away somewhere in my calc?

C] How easy will it be to transfer files to and from KnightOS to the computer?  Could I just hook the calculator up and treat it like any other USB device, or will I have to use a special program?

D] Will KnightOS have usb support built in?  What about support for that little circly thing that I can play music out of? 

E] Could I play music with KnightOS?  How good will it be?  If I have music running on one program, could I switch over to another program and play, say, Tetris while listening to the original running in the background?

F] How compatible will this be with the lab instruments you can hook up to the z80 calculators? 


I doubt that not even Sir can aswer some of those, but I want answers, yes :D

Offline jnesselr

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #428 on: November 13, 2010, 10:22:44 am »
Note, that I am not SirCmpwn and that he can probably answer these more accurately.  This is what I have gotten from what I know about the project:

0] If you are a dev like I am, you can get the dev version of the kernel to create things with it.  Basically writing utilities like text editors, etc. is our job.

1] No dual boot.  I thought about the option of putting in a flash drive to save all files of KOS/TIOS to a flash drive and reinstalling the os from the last backup of the other one.

2] It depends on what we add.  I'm thinking about simple manipulation like multiplying polynomials, but not hard-core math stuff.  I don't know about derivatives/integrals, but maybe.  That would add a lot of code, though.

3] ASM games must be ported if they use b_calls and such, and be ported to use .org $0 and so on.  Basic games need the full TIOS, and I don't see reason for a converter.  It would most likely make inefficient code.  Not sure how the language of KBasic is just yet.

4] In ASM, maybe.  Not sure about native structures just yet.

5] I don't know on the font.

6] The main programming language is Z80 ASM.  Not sure about KBasic just yet.

7] No idea.  That depends on if we add it.  I'm thinking that it can be faster, but I'm not sure.  3D will probably be allowed, but probably not 4D.

8] Not sure.  ASM will have the speed of ASM, except for when you first run it, because it adjusts all the calls, but other than that, the asm speed throughout the program is the same.

9] Again, not sure.  I don't know if he is using 9 bytes Floating point or what.

A] Not sure.  Probably not unless some lib is made for it.

B] I know SirCmpwn is working on that.  I doubt you could just run Powerpoint or word.  C2I is a project by me and alberthrocks to get Internet to the calc, so not sure about KOS in this respect.  I doubt it, though.

C] I know SirCmpwn is also working on getting the calc to look like a flash drive.  So, drag and drop.  Also, by "any other UDB device", I'm assuming that you mean flash drives.

D] Yes. And by "little circly thing", I assume you mean the I/O port.  And maybe.  I know you can still mess with the port itself, but I don't know about built-in routines.

E] See [D]  But yes, multitasking is implemented already in the kernel, so theoretically, yes.

F] Not very.  We don't know much about those instruments at all.  So, I doubt they would be compatible Simply because we don't know how they work.

Offline Munchor

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #429 on: November 13, 2010, 10:29:30 am »
Note, that I am not SirCmpwn and that he can probably answer these more accurately.  This is what I have gotten from what I know about the project:

0] If you are a dev like I am, you can get the dev version of the kernel to create things with it.  Basically writing utilities like text editors, etc. is our job.

1] No dual boot.  I thought about the option of putting in a flash drive to save all files of KOS/TIOS to a flash drive and reinstalling the os from the last backup of the other one.

2] It depends on what we add.  I'm thinking about simple manipulation like multiplying polynomials, but not hard-core math stuff.  I don't know about derivatives/integrals, but maybe.  That would add a lot of code, though.

3] ASM games must be ported if they use b_calls and such, and be ported to use .org $0 and so on.  Basic games need the full TIOS, and I don't see reason for a converter.  It would most likely make inefficient code.  Not sure how the language of KBasic is just yet.

4] In ASM, maybe.  Not sure about native structures just yet.

5] I don't know on the font.

6] The main programming language is Z80 ASM.  Not sure about KBasic just yet.

7] No idea.  That depends on if we add it.  I'm thinking that it can be faster, but I'm not sure.  3D will probably be allowed, but probably not 4D.

8] Not sure.  ASM will have the speed of ASM, except for when you first run it, because it adjusts all the calls, but other than that, the asm speed throughout the program is the same.

9] Again, not sure.  I don't know if he is using 9 bytes Floating point or what.

A] Not sure.  Probably not unless some lib is made for it.

B] I know SirCmpwn is working on that.  I doubt you could just run Powerpoint or word.  C2I is a project by me and alberthrocks to get Internet to the calc, so not sure about KOS in this respect.  I doubt it, though.

C] I know SirCmpwn is also working on getting the calc to look like a flash drive.  So, drag and drop.  Also, by "any other UDB device", I'm assuming that you mean flash drives.

D] Yes. And by "little circly thing", I assume you mean the I/O port.  And maybe.  I know you can still mess with the port itself, but I don't know about built-in routines.

E] See [D]  But yes, multitasking is implemented already in the kernel, so theoretically, yes.

F] Not very.  We don't know much about those instruments at all.  So, I doubt they would be compatible Simply because we don't know how they work.

My great question is: Can we keep the files we used to have in the normal OS (Apps, Programs,...) or we have to backup them?

Offline jnesselr

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #430 on: November 13, 2010, 10:32:47 am »
Please don't quote huge bodies of text unless they are in Spoilers or something.  Or if you have a specific question about one of them in this case [1] and delete everything else.  KK, just more OCD than usual today for some reason. Maybe I should put mine in a spoiler...</offtopic>

1] No dual boot.  I thought about the option of putting in a flash drive to save all files of KOS/TIOS to a flash drive and reinstalling the os from the last backup of the other one.
My great question is: Can we keep the files we used to have in the normal OS (Apps, Programs,...) or we have to backup them?

Anyway, no, you can't keep them, you would have to back them up.

Offline Deep Toaster

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #431 on: November 13, 2010, 10:41:15 am »
B] Could I use my calc as a USB device?  Could I attach it to the computer, transfer, say, a Powerpoint document, take it to school, then run it directly from the calc?  Could I transfer something on the size of Word documents?  Could I secretly have a web browser tucked away somewhere in my calc?

Wow, .ppt might be a bit big for a calc, though...

Please don't quote huge bodies of text unless they are in Spoilers or something.  Or if you have a specific question about one of them in this case [1] and delete everything else.  KK, just more OCD than usual today for some reason. Maybe I should put mine in a spoiler...</offtopic>

1] No dual boot.  I thought about the option of putting in a flash drive to save all files of KOS/TIOS to a flash drive and reinstalling the os from the last backup of the other one.
My great question is: Can we keep the files we used to have in the normal OS (Apps, Programs,...) or we have to backup them?

Anyway, no, you can't keep them, you would have to back them up.

Yeah, different format. That's also part of the reason you can't dual-boot.




Offline Michael_Lee

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #432 on: November 13, 2010, 10:44:38 am »
B] Could I use my calc as a USB device?  Could I attach it to the computer, transfer, say, a Powerpoint document, take it to school, then run it directly from the calc?  Could I transfer something on the size of Word documents?  Could I secretly have a web browser tucked away somewhere in my calc?

Wow, .ppt might be a bit big for a calc, though...

Yeah, but think of the awesomeness factor!
Math class:
"Hello, today I'm going to be giving a presentation on prime numbers.  Ohwait, excuse me for one moment while I hook my calculator up..."
Class gets confused and starts chattering.  Math teacher + exasperated friends facepalm in unison, then starts silently laughing/crying/shaking their head in disbelief.
"There we go!"  (Clicks around for a while)
"Okay."  [click right arrow on calc] "Now, the interesting thing about prime numbers is..."

« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 10:50:18 am by Michael_Lee »
My website: Currently boring.

Projects:
Axe Interpreter
   > Core: Done
   > Memory: Need write code to add constants.
   > Graphics: Rewritten.  Needs to integrate sprites with constants.
   > IO: GetKey done.  Need to add mostly homescreen IO stuff.
Croquette:
   > Stomping bugs
   > Internet version: On hold until I can make my website less boring/broken.

Offline matthias1992

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #433 on: November 13, 2010, 10:46:14 am »
if sizes become a problem then on-comuter conversion and maybe compression must be done (?)

good querstions though, I am curious about those as well...
MASM xxxxxxxxxx aborted | SADce ====:::::: 40% -Halted until further notice| XAOS =====::::: 50% -Units done| SKYBOX2D engine ========== 100% -Pre-alpha done. Need to  document it and extend |

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Offline Munchor

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Re: KnightOS
« Reply #434 on: November 13, 2010, 10:47:19 am »
I also agree that .ppt would be quite big, but an equivalent to power points in calculator would be cool for tests.


Again, alternatives to NoteFlio for tests :D IN KnightOS