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Author Topic: Mimas by Benjamin Moody  (Read 58822 times)

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Offline Deep Toaster

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #120 on: October 10, 2010, 03:26:44 pm »
Quote from: ztrumpet on October 10, 2010, 03:26:06 pm
Quote from: Deep Thought on October 10, 2010, 03:23:57 pm
Doesn't Axe still require that we sign the app ourselves? Is there a way it could be done on-calc?
Yes, but there's a simple drag and drop batch file included with Axe now. :)
Signing on calc would take between 5 and 15 minutes and is not very practical. :(

Oh, got it.

What does signing do, anyway?
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Offline calcdude84se

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #121 on: October 10, 2010, 03:27:59 pm »
It prevents your calc from rejecting it (saying "invalid") went sent from another calc/a computer.
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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #122 on: October 10, 2010, 04:16:23 pm »
Ah. How big would an on-calc signing prgm be? Even if it is slow, maybe it could be used for final versions? For example, someone else might really, really need that app on their calc :D
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Offline Builderboy

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #123 on: October 10, 2010, 04:17:33 pm »
Probably not very big, just not very fast.  You would have to ask an expert though
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SirCmpwn

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #124 on: October 10, 2010, 04:17:34 pm »
It would be faster to send someone the source code and a compiler, then compile it on their calc than it would be to sign it on-calc.
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ASHBAD_ALVIN

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #125 on: October 10, 2010, 04:18:36 pm »
.. or make it so that the first time you run the app it signs itself ;)
jk
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Offline Builderboy

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #126 on: October 10, 2010, 04:19:35 pm »
Yeah but nobody wants to wait 15 min for their game to load :P
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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #127 on: October 10, 2010, 04:19:48 pm »
Quote from: SirCmpwn on October 10, 2010, 04:17:34 pm
It would be faster to send someone the source code and a compiler, then compile it on their calc than it would be to sign it on-calc.

Right, true.

Anyway, back to Mimas, are there any serious bugs yet?
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ASHBAD_ALVIN

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #128 on: October 10, 2010, 04:19:58 pm »
lol very true very true my good sir :P
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Offline calcdude84se

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #129 on: October 10, 2010, 04:21:48 pm »
BrandonW's RESIGN program is 1829 bytes on-calc, for those who care.
As for Mimas, the only bug mentioned so far AFIAK is that << and >> don't work.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2010, 04:22:06 pm by calcdude84se »
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Offline DJ Omnimaga

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #130 on: October 10, 2010, 11:35:57 pm »
I think the only on-calc assemblers that ever came out besides Mimas are Mon 83, TASM-on-calc, Chasm and OTBP. Mon 83 was extremly slow due to being in BASIC and required you to manually paste your string of code in a program with AsmPrgm at the beginning. I don't know about TASM-on-calc and OTBP, though. Chasm was unstable. Chasm 2 was in development back in 2004 but the author vanished completly. I'M glad there are some new tools offering more freedom now (and space).
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Offline FloppusMaximus

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #131 on: October 11, 2010, 12:47:57 am »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe BrandonW's re-signing program is only for signing OSes, not apps.  App signing uses the Rabin algorithm, which is substantially faster than RSA if implemented correctly.

Creating apps with Mimas is certainly doable, but would involve a fair amount of code (and multipage apps even more so.)  So the eternal question is, how much is it worth in terms of code size?  Like I said in my initial post on UTI, I'm already pushing the limits of what a 2-page application can do; would it be better to increase this to 3 or even 4 pages (and include all the incredible features I can think of), or would it be better to keep it smaller and simpler, so that it's still reasonably usable on the 83+ BE?  Or would it be better for me to try to implement extra features as plugins?

(By the way, I guess I should mention that you can already create single-page applications with Mimas... you'd just need an external tool to install them into Flash.)

Oh, and no, Mimas can't assemble itself (not yet, anyway), due to the lack of macros.  And of course the fact that you don't have enough RAM to store the entire thing.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2010, 12:54:28 am by FloppusMaximus »
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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #132 on: October 11, 2010, 01:13:31 am »
I assume the app creation process is similar to Axe Parser, right? (code your program, choose APP compiling mode, (backup, ) compile, send to computer, use Rabbit/Wapp/Wabbitsign to sign it)
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Offline ztrumpet

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #133 on: October 11, 2010, 07:15:54 am »
I vote for a three or four page App, but I do not have an 83+ anymore.  Let's see what most 83+s should have: DoorsCS7 (3 pages) Axe Parser (2 pages) CalcSys (1 page) Mimas (2+x pages).  Hmm, running out of space, and this doesn't even include programs. D:

I really want these features!  Would it be possible to have them as an "Add in"? ;D
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ASHBAD_ALVIN

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Re: Mimas by Benjamin Moody
« Reply #134 on: October 11, 2010, 08:10:24 am »
It would be so much easier with app signing, but I guess a bit more difficult.  We would probably have to add in the headers and such ourselves, and manage pagees on our own because everyone knows how crappy it is to write an app with all your routines on the first page, and your calls to the routines in pages 2+ :(

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