Author Topic: Alien Breed 5  (Read 22399 times)

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Offline DJ Omnimaga

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #30 on: August 01, 2012, 04:12:40 pm »
Looks pretty cool, as always. :)

One suggestion I have, though, would be to update the wall graphics in a way that they look more 3D-ish. Not real 3D, but I mean like, instead of flat walls like in the first NES Dragon Warrior/Quest game, make them like Dragon Warrior 2, 3 and 4 instead, where walls have some depth, or like in Joltima. Another idea would be like Zelda on the SNES and GB, although smaller to not force a full map change. It would update the game graphics to today's calculator ASM standards. That said, the way the game looks at the moment looks pretty nice too. :)

Offline JamesV

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #31 on: August 03, 2012, 06:12:21 am »
Looks pretty cool, as always. :)

One suggestion I have, though, would be to update the wall graphics in a way that they look more 3D-ish. Not real 3D, but I mean like, instead of flat walls like in the first NES Dragon Warrior/Quest game, make them like Dragon Warrior 2, 3 and 4 instead, where walls have some depth, or like in Joltima. Another idea would be like Zelda on the SNES and GB, although smaller to not force a full map change. It would update the game graphics to today's calculator ASM standards. That said, the way the game looks at the moment looks pretty nice too. :)

Thanks DJ_O :)

I'm kind of glad you mentioned that... It had been bugging me a little too, and now you've given me the motivation to look at it a bit closer.

I don't really want to give too much of a 3D effect, but giving the walls a bit of depth / texture would be good. I've been looking at the original game a bit closer and how the walls are drawn on there. Obviously I'm working with monochrome as opposed to a colour palette.

Here's an image comparing the original game walls to my new proposed walls, as well as having the tiled floor outline.. Thoughts?

The only downside is that I'll have 17 "wall" tiles, instead of 1, so the level compression won't be as good. But hopefully it doesn't affect it too drastically :)



EDIT - updated the image & post, to show possible new tiled floor outline as well as possible new walls
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 08:26:11 am by JamesV »

Offline leafy

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #32 on: August 03, 2012, 10:22:23 am »
You could always generate "dynamic" wall tiles. Just use 1 wall tile in your tilemap, but while loading the map make it detect what types of tiles are immediately adjacent to it. Then, you can figure out what kind of tile image is supposed to go there. If you do this, I recommend calculating all the tile image types beforehand. It'll take a bit of time and space, but the level compression will save more in the long run.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 10:22:38 am by leafy »
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Offline TIfanx1999

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #33 on: August 03, 2012, 10:34:15 am »
I like it James, it's a good look. =)

Offline Hayleia

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #34 on: August 03, 2012, 10:42:53 am »
You could always generate "dynamic" wall tiles. Just use 1 wall tile in your tilemap, but while loading the map make it detect what types of tiles are immediately adjacent to it. Then, you can figure out what kind of tile image is supposed to go there. If you do this, I recommend calculating all the tile image types beforehand. It'll take a bit of time and space, but the level compression will save more in the long run.
^This. Keep one wall tile in the compressed data and decompress it into several types of wall when decompressing :)
And this is indeed very beautiful like that :D
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Offline JamesV

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #35 on: August 03, 2012, 11:15:11 pm »
Here's something new I've tried, going even closer to the original game in terms of wall tiles. Thoughts on this one? Better / worse?


Offline DJ Omnimaga

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #36 on: August 04, 2012, 12:30:33 am »
Wow that last one looks great too! I like the previous image, but this one is better imho. Also if you use dynamic walls, you could save lots of space.

Offline squidgetx

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #37 on: August 04, 2012, 12:50:24 am »
This looks awesome so far.

As for the wall tiles, I agree I like this last version as well. Perhaps make the overall static pattern a tad darker?

Offline JamesV

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #38 on: August 04, 2012, 10:21:02 am »
Thanks guys :) I think it's looking good but can still be improved, although I'm struggling to find a better design right now, so I'll work on some other parts and come back to this wall tiling issue in a few days, hopefully with fresh inspiration :)

Offline TIfanx1999

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #39 on: August 04, 2012, 11:09:44 am »
I think I actually like the first one better. The thicker and cleaner and lines make it look a lot better imho. It's always difficult to find the right balance between detail and function when working so small.

Offline Hayleia

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2012, 01:49:18 am »
If you need some more opinions, I prefer the second one. The first one is too simple in my opinion :)
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Offline V1mes

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #41 on: August 08, 2012, 06:51:41 am »
The second one definitely looks better...
The first one is too simple in my opinion :)
But it may be a look slightly busy/distracting during gameplay  :-X
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Offline TIfanx1999

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #42 on: August 08, 2012, 07:31:59 am »
I assume you are referring to the second image V1mes?

Offline V1mes

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #43 on: August 08, 2012, 07:39:52 am »
Indeed
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Offline JamesV

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Re: Alien Breed 5
« Reply #44 on: August 08, 2012, 08:16:02 am »
After further experimentation, I've decided to stick with (at least for now) the more random looking type walls. When I applied them to the game, I thought they looked a bit better, and not as distracting as the the larger blown up image above. Also, it looks much closer to the original Amiga games imo :)

Either way, it's not necessarily set in stone. I've done the hard work in recoding the tileset and converting the old level data to suit. So at least now if I decided to change the wall textures again, it should be as simple as just redrawing the 21 wall tiles, unless it was a radical change that required more / less wall tile variations.

I also used an idea suggested by leafy and a few others which was to store the wall tiles all as a single tile-type, and then when a level is decompressed, a routine calculates what each wall tile should be changed to. This means that the compression on the levels will stay almost the same, but that the levels look much nicer. The only downside (which you can see below) is that the level takes a few seconds to load, but I think the extra compression pay off is worthwhile.

Here are a couple of things to look at. The still image shows the same portion of level 3 both in-game & in the level editor, to demonstrate how the level is stored as basic wall blocks, but re-processed when a level is decompressed & loaded in-game to show dynamic walls. The animated clip shows some of level 1 in action. As can see, it looks much nicer than the earlier clip of level 1 that I posted last week :)